Corniness

[Slim Fiasco]

Firs of all (there's no second), I want to say that with English being my foreign language my tolerance for corny things is rather big. As far as music goes that is. So tell me how much do lines that you find corny bother you? Like, in Hopsin's Ill Mind Of Hopsin 4 the line "it sucks so much I get blow jobs from it" is great to me but I assume that you guys don't share the same feelings, which makes me come up with some conclusions as well as questions.

For example, I think that artist don't catch flack with non-English speakers over lines of that proportion and given that most people don't even bother with the lyrical part it's easier for them to appeal to more listeners. Further more, they can come across as better than they actually are and hence "all the whack shit on the radio" garbage. The pros here being, good artist can more easily appeal to more devoted Hip-Hop listeners as well, mainly because wordplay tends to be even worse in other languages (at least in mine) and thus again making them look more amazing than they really are.

However, my ultimate question is should rappers go easy on metaphors, punch-lines and all that? I think they do because it's much easier to go wrong with wordplay attempts and get ridiculed among the "proper" listeners (Em's recovery being the prime example). As far as I am concerned, content and rhyming should be the main goals of MC's lyrics. Good stories and introspective verses are always a worthy listen and people tend to find those more relatable.

[dead prez]

I don't mind metaphors and wordplay so long as they fit into the context of the verses and aren't just plugged in as a complete non sequiter. I think subtelty is the best way to approach it where you don't waste lines attempting explain you godawful wordplay. Many times people who whine about the punchlines aren't just being wilfully contrarion, it's because most of them are godawful and hamfisted as fuck being a sign that more awful lines are to come and the verse sacrifices substance for wordplay. The worst part about many of the "corny" lines are they are just fucking funny that make you want to laugh in the worst way possible, making you think why on earth anyone would think that line was clever or funny and disrupt the flow of the verse, that is unless the verse was already chockfull of shitty lines, than it's a lost cause.

[ThomasJ]

diction?

[dead prez]

I've had many names...

[ThomasJ]

And one of them was diction. lol

Wasn't sure if it was you and I didn't feel like browsing through your posts so I asked you, and while you didn't directly answer my question, I saw through the veil of mystery surrounding your post and concluded that indeed it is you whom I assumed is diction.

[Slim Fiasco]

I don't mind metaphors and wordplay so long as they fit into the context of the verses and aren't just plugged in as a complete non sequiter. I think subtelty is the best way to approach it where you don't waste lines attempting explain you godawful wordplay. Many times people who whine about the punchlines aren't just being wilfully contrarion, it's because most of them are godawful and hamfisted as fuck being a sign that more awful lines are to come and the verse sacrifices substance for wordplay. The worst part about many of the "corny" lines are they are just fucking funny that make you want to laugh in the worst way possible, making you think why on earth anyone would think that line was clever or funny and disrupt the flow of the verse, that is unless the verse was already chockfull of shitty lines, than it's a lost cause.

Hey man, glad to see you back. You better stick around! And yes, explaining takes all the fun from complexity and it's really illogical. My favorite type is definitely the way Lupe is doing it, and as you'd agree I love how Big L delivered his punch-lines for the way you say it is very important as well.

[dead prez]

Yeah, I'm not really back but this thread was worth responding to, loll. I actually like Big L type lines the most, meaning ones that don't aspire to be complex but get straight to the point, yet are still witty and eye brow raising. Lupe's pretty good with double entendres and wordplay too, even though he tends to reach at times, but he knows how to make subtle lines as well layered wordplay.

Delivery and timing is also important and may for some reason overlook it, focusig solely on the content of the wordplay, it has to flow organically in the verse and the person delivering it has to have strong mic presence and not sound goofy saying it.

[Devil'sAdvocate]

good punchlines and wordplay should not be noticed so to speak.

they need to be a part of the verse and flow right through it,most rappers who attempt punchlines and metaphors make their lines stick out like a sore thumb in what ever part of the verse it is.

plus the way a punchline is delivered and presented matters.

in short,wordplay should be a part of the verse,not some pretentious add on.

[Kez]

good punchlines and wordplay should not be noticed so to speak.

they need to be a part of the verse and flow right through it,most rappers who attempt punchlines and metaphors make their lines stick out like a sore thumb in what ever part of the verse it is.

plus the way a punchline is delivered and presented matters.

in short,wordplay should be a part of the verse,not some pretentious add on.

First time in a while that I actually agree with DA (though I lol'd @ "pretentious")

[Slim Fiasco]

Yeah, I'm not really back but this thread was worth responding to, loll. I actually like Big L type lines the most, meaning ones that don't aspire to be complex but get straight to the point, yet are still witty and eye brow raising. Lupe's pretty good with double entendres and wordplay too, even though he tends to reach at times, but he knows how to make subtle lines as well layered wordplay.

Delivery and timing is also important and may for some reason overlook it, focusig solely on the content of the wordplay, it has to flow organically in the verse and the person delivering it has to have strong mic presence and not sound goofy saying it.

Well thanks but you should be back for good . And well said, I agree.

[Slim Fiasco]

good punchlines and wordplay should not be noticed so to speak.

they need to be a part of the verse and flow right through it,most rappers who attempt punchlines and metaphors make their lines stick out like a sore thumb in what ever part of the verse it is.

plus the way a punchline is delivered and presented matters.

in short,wordplay should be a part of the verse,not some pretentious add on.

[VenomBlackViper]

good punchlines and wordplay should not be noticed so to speak.

they need to be a part of the verse and flow right through it,most rappers who attempt punchlines and metaphors make their lines stick out like a sore thumb in what ever part of the verse it is.

plus the way a punchline is delivered and presented matters.

in short,wordplay should be a part of the verse,not some pretentious add on.

But, you're a Crooked I fan, his punchlines are like the exact opposite of what you described.

[Sekou]

This is the resurrection thread of those presumed dead!

diction.. ThomasJ.. who's next!?

[Devil'sAdvocate]

good punchlines and wordplay should not be noticed so to speak.

they need to be a part of the verse and flow right through it,most rappers who attempt punchlines and metaphors make their lines stick out like a sore thumb in what ever part of the verse it is.

plus the way a punchline is delivered and presented matters.

in short,wordplay should be a part of the verse,not some pretentious add on.

But, you're a Crooked I fan, his punchlines are like the exact opposite of what you described.

Never.