Know why Em/Shady's marketing is terrible? The staff

[CanadaPure]

I don't think anyone would feel comfortable saying, "Yeah man, last week I was bumping Bobby Creekwater, his album is tight as fuck, yo!"

Same goes for Ca$his imo. I listen to him sometimes, but I don't think I could brag about it.

[CanadaPure]

Is Shady records held accountable for any artists personal problems?

I agree that track record is pretty bad if your talking about sales but that wont affect myself for listening or buying there music. I don't really like Stat, Bobby or Cashis.

Lets face it those artists music dont appeal to the average music fan.

Neither does Yelawolfs or Slaughterhouse. The problem was they tried to appeal to the average listener, so a lot of the hardcore fans didn't like it, and a lot of the average fans didn't even know it existed because they weren't marketed.

It was the perfect storm for Flopperhouse.

[cityfan31]

But that's not fair of me. I'm sure you've learned some skills in your four years that nobody else can learn without a formal education. So what are they? I'm curious. What makes your education worth its cost?

The sense of superiority it's given her?

Nah, I'm just kidding. I think you probably can learn some technicalities of marketing and shit on a course but it's hardly rocket science is it. There will be loads of people who made their business and product thrive without any formal education.

[CanadaPure]

Slow down there. Wait...so to earn a large profit you have to receive a lot more money than you spend? This shit's a little too complicated for me. I might have to enrol in an advertising class to get my head around this.

That was hilarious, but please don't double post Amadeo.

[EminemBase]

What do you want Em to do? Plaster Slaughterhouse and Yelawolf's names everywhere? That shit won't help. You think album sales really boost just because they're doing interviews and promoting their albums?

The PEOPLE get to CHOOSE whether they want to buy the album or not. Slaughterhouse and Yelawolf were already moderately known before they were signed, so promotion wasn't a big deal for them.

No, any high school kid can do that. I'm talking things like SEO optimization, PPC advertising, point-of-purchase displays, monitoring ROI, etc. I'm just tossing terms out, but I'm not going to take the time to explain what it would take years at a university to even begin to understand. It doesn't matter how big you are, marketing is huge.

You don't need university to understand all of that actually.

That's my background and I'm self-taught.

Industrialized education is beyond overrated. Many of the ( in fact basically every single one I can think of ) top artistic and business geniuses I can think of - dropped out of school and did their own thing. College and university education is for people who don't question too much.

The marketing of Em and his image has been genius. Talking about things like PPC when it comes to the marketing of an artist is absurd. Eminem is beyond bigger than PPC campaigns lmao! he's not a brand, he's an effect; behind his effect there are themes (rebellion, edge, mystique) which have been carefully nurtured and are also a natural result of him as a person, but PPC is not at all what grows an artist. Great art is. Shady 2.0 has failed because the music was compromised.

Plain and simple.

Clearly Em and his team know what they're doing in terms of sending out images, timing and marketing ethos - from his album covers, from his selected appearances and when he does appear: for what purposes : in his hush-hush approach, in his professional release of statements on issues vs. loose-lipped, tacky magazine gossip. They know exactly what they're doing. It just hasn't been working with YH and SH because their music doesn't match the approach. It's a con.

[Amaranthine]

I could do better.

[BigBoss]

Amaranthine4ShadyMarketing

[cityfan31]

I don't think Slaughterhouse was a failure. I enjoyed their album a lot.

Radioactive was a massive mistake. The 2 cuts off Trunk Music Returnz are better than anything on that album. Yela has so much personality, but it was completely overwhelmed by the poppy hooks aimed at radio. But none of it was catchy enough to ever have a chance of becoming a hit.

Em's own marketing is genius. Absolutely genius. Biggest selling artist of 2000-2010 says it all really.

[NextEpisode]

5 pages and Steve Berman is yet to be mentioned?.. Come’ on...

Who's Steve Berman? He's the President of Sales and Marketing at Interscope Records. You'll find that on 3 Eminem albums, and one D12 album, a 'Steve Berman' skit is featured. Showcasing and exaggerating the pressure faced from the record label (Interscope) to sell records. The skit from MMLP probably demonstrates this point best.

Details are important. Eminem didn't sign a contract to Shady Records in 1998, he signed to Aftermath Entertainment/Interscope Records. His [signed] obligations are thus not to Shady Records, and most of the marketing of Eminem is handled by Steve Berman/Interscope. At least he likes to take credit for it, lol. This is also the case for 50 cent.

In regards to Yelawolf, he was initially signed to Interscope. The change to Shady Records/Interscope was arguably merely a lateral change, in the sense that the main agreements & obligations remained being to Interscope. In fact, this type of deal is very common in the music industry. For example; B.O.B. first signed with Atlantic, then shifted to T.I.'s Atlantic-distributed Grand Hustle label. From the head-label’s perspective, this is basically a marketing strategy; you introduce new artists by pairing them with an already-established brand.

Before one complains about marketing team X’s work for label Y and artist Z, one must first reflect over why it is that marketing team X is hired in the first place? In the case of artists Z1= Yelawolf, Z2= Slaughterhouse, and label Y=Shady Records, it would seem that the head-label (Interscope), or the head of Shady Records (Paul Rosenberg), made the evaluation that budget V would be appropriate for these projects. Thus, a constraint is set in motion. Shady Records can’t hire any marketing team in the world, only within the available budget. In addition there is also a question about how priorities should be made. It is probably not wise to spend 90 % of the budget on marketing, and 10 % on production/engineering etc.

That said, one can still argue whether the marketing has been properly executed. My main point is basically that one should always try to look at the “whole picture", not just the fragment that is most visible and easiest to criticize.

[momentsgolden]

First off, Eminem is marketed by INTERSCOPE and Yela by SHADY RECORDS. There is a big difference between the ability and capability of the two. So, all the eminem comparisons are basically off.

Second, i agree with eminembase. Institutionalised education is overrated. Information is widely available if u want to be self taught especially if u are willing to spend money buying the books/ material necessary. But that ignores kathy's assertion... SOME basis for your arguments gotta exist. She gave great examples. Maybe u were an intern (like the majority of industry artists that base pointed out dropped outta college). Maybe u read it up (like Mike on suits ). Or maybe u some project from the gut and it worked (project x). Either way, sayin "its logic" jus makes ur argumentation weaker.

About if marketing is necessary/ helpful. Of course it is. Epecially given the lil wayne example. But i would go deeper than that. The industry has so much politics that a person who is versed in RAP MARKETING shuld know. Whether its the pace (bpm or sumthin) a beat requires to be played in the club; who, where, how and if to preview the album (Kendrick spent MONTHS doing this across the country 4 example. I only remember 3 websites havin a preview of Welcome to Our House); things like the timin of the year when new artists sell large numbers (random example... U wont debut at Christmas). Things like gettin deals to get ur physical copies in target and walmart (this was a problem for nicki) and other basic things. Alchemist once said he ddnt want a nina sky hook but after it was explained that radio tests whether people like ur song or not by playin 10 seconds of the hook to random called up samples it made sense to him. I could give more example and go into specifics with slaughterhouse but thats for later.


Then, on this INSANE notion that yelawolf is NOT marketable. LMFAO!! Yelawolf is a skater, white, rapper from the south who loves big cars and drinkin. ANY ONE of those things could make him famous NOW lol. The world is jus a web of niches and there is no "definition" of whats marketable of not.

To slaughterhouse... You all realise these guys gained underground buzz right?! The question was not if they were marketable to preteen kids. It would never have worked and Park it Sideways is living proof. Slaughterhouse was meant for the hiphopdx/ trshday/ deadendhiphop/ smack/ucl/ suckerfree/ pusha t audience!! They could have marketed themselves to that crowd.

Now, about the music... Marketing AFFECTS THE MUSIC!! Smfh. I'll give kendrick as an example.

1- he already had gkmc concepts in 2010 but ddnt drop until he had a good enuf buzz. He released OD, Section 80 tide over fans. When slaughterhouse had a buzz, the let it go. On the House timin was awful

2- kendrick lamar had a certified BANGER in the recipe but he did not market it. That and my life are basically the same type record. Look up his interviews.

3- Kendrick made his first single with a view of it "bringing the mainstream to him."

4- collaborations were chosen wisely. The City had a scorchin verse, fuckin problems had a questionable one. Both served their purpose.

5- Dr dre's involvement was handled with care to not overshadow him yet adequately support him.


Now, i chose kendrick not coz i'm a stan but he's the first that comes to mind. I could give examples of Tech N9ne, Rihanna, Beyonce of the marketing actively influencing the music.

Now, i cant load those images but from the about that AbramIssac posted... It does look like a bunch of amateurs.

[Trimss]

I don't think Slaughterhouse was a failure. I enjoyed their album a lot.

Radioactive was a massive mistake. The 2 cuts off Trunk Music Returnz are better than anything on that album. Yela has so much personality, but it was completely overwhelmed by the poppy hooks aimed at radio. But none of it was catchy enough to ever have a chance of becoming a hit.

Em's own marketing is genius. Absolutely genius. Biggest selling artist of 2000-2010 says it all really.

I disagree. Radioactive and WTOH were kinda similar, but I feel like Radioactive was a much better attempt at doing that "poppy" style.

[Trimss]

Word, and even Throw It Up was good until Gangsta Boo and Eminem came in. I mean yeah people overreacted and hated on it way too much (even though it's not a good verse, it's still better than anything from the pill era), but Yela definitely killed the song and made that bitch and Em sound stupid.

Good Girl was.. Eh. The Hardest Love Song In the World was also meh, but better than Good Girl.

But I'm not mad at him, because minus those two, the album is really good. I'm really mad at Eminem for not getting him that RiRi feature on Made in Usa though, because that other cunt sounded exactly like her.. But with Rihanna's popularity, it could have been a huge patriotic hit.

Ah.. If I was Eminem.. Yelawolf would have been as big as Tyga or Asap.

[Trimss]

Yeah but Rihanna isn't even American lol. I could see why her being on there wouldn't make a lot of sense.

... I forgot about that, honestly. You're right though.

And while we're talking about sales, Radioactive sold like 570 albums past week and Slaughterhouse 590. So it's still comercially more successful than WTOH. He's reaching 200 000 albums sold soon, it's not that bad in 2013..

But Love Story will sell more.

[SoldierShady]

I totally endorse this thread.

[AbramIsaac]

I think that people are overreacting to Kathy's way of presenting her point, and missing the fact that most of us agree with her about her core message.

Granted, her reminders of how she understands the business side of this in an academic sense because of her education might rub you the wrong way, but that's not really the argument. The question is whether or not we believe the marketing for Shady Records isn't all that good. The answer most would give if asked that question outside of this thread would be: yes.

One would be hard pressed to find a member here (prior to this thread) that feels like the marketing at Shady Records is good*. Most fans here know that it leaves a lot to be desired. While the marketability of the 2.0 artists can be argued, and the artistic integrity of the projects themselves is certainly a big factor, the truth is also that they don't market their acts very well. At least, that's been the general consensus among most of us here since Radioactive dropped. While the compromised nature of that record wouldn't have sit well with existing fans, it's impossible to ignore the fact that it was a very commercially viable project, and had it been marketed correctly, it would have sold more--even if those sales were to people that don't even know what the term "artistic integrity" means.

These aren't things you need a college degree to understand. As I said, most everyone would agree that the marketing is subpar. What Kathy was initially doing was actually showing who the marketing company was that's in charge of executing the promotion for Shady Records projects. All of her remarks about their education levels and appearance aside, I think it speaks volumes about the company when you see their CEO popping champagne bottles like a buffoon, and their very own "About Us" page on their website looks like it was written by a drunk high schooler on their iPhone.

I'm sure Burnitdown isn't to blame for everything, but I would think that they would have went with a different company, judging both by how the company presents itself, and the lack of success to this point.

* Shady 2.0 specifically, minus Eminem of course.