MMLP2 is NOT a classic.

[Ares]

MMLP2 is better than Encore, Relapse and Recovery but it isn't classic. It's too early.

Headlights has way more potential to be a classic. Everything about that song is perfect.

Yea, besides the hook and beat

[EminemBase]

Although a great concept, Bad Guy is not a classic. Especially not in the same league as Stan. Stan was executed perfectly in every aspect, while Bad Guy's seconds verse is just...meh. Sure, the last verse is groundbreaking, but not enough to bring the whole song up to Stan's level.

Headlights has way more potential to be a classic. Everything about that song is perfect.

True. I want "Bad Guy" to be more amazing than it is.

Everybody mentions the last verse only...

That's a pretty disappointing failure for a 'stan 2' if the only thing people mention is some epic closing side-verse and nothing else about the song. The shit is fucking 7 minutes.

Nobody just mentions one part of 'stan', the song itself, is a masterpiece.

When he says 'it's just me you and the music now Slim!', that shows the potential of what it could have been. I like that he had the guts to fuck with the flow like that but... that 'live voice' as apposed to a rap flow: totally brings it to live. It feels like it jumps to life as soon as he does that.

[momentsgolden]

That said, classic using the reviews/ sales would be cool if Encore ddnt get all that. The critics did not slam that record. Relapse was the best selling hip-hop album of that year. Recovery (which i *could* prefer) had a higher Critics/ awards/ sales/ cultural impact.

Nah Recovery had significantly lower ratings. It averaged a 63/100. So far MMLP2 debuted with higher sales so all it needs to do is continue its course to completely overshadow Recovery. Encore got lower reviews as well. This is his highest rated album since TES

I've always wondered why people look at numbers at metacritic/rottentomatoes/any other aggregating site and believe what is written. I mean, i dont know, there is just so much DEPTH in words that numbers cant say. If one looks at Yeezus numbers for example, they would think it achieved universal acclaim while the written reviews show a clear "i dont get it, but its Kanye so score him high" vibe. Contrast that with the genuine "this was amazing" vibe of MBDTF.

If i am to be completely, utterly honest, Eminem just isnt that big of a deal in 2013 anymore. People say "yeah he is good, he has always been good" and they lazily slap high ratings on it.

Contrast that with 2010 Eminem. Off the back of 2 poorly received albums (Relapse reception can be described as mixed at best) there was a "How good is this guy anyway" look at those records. Revisionists will claim otherwise but a good majority of hip-hop actually liked that record.

tl/dr- to turn a cynic into a believer is so much harder than to maintain the love of an admirer.

[kkaniff]

I don't think it's possible to appreciate the genius that is Stan and then overlook the first three verses of Bad Guy.
I've said this before, but as a potrait of psychosis, Bad Guy is by far the better crafted record. Every thing Stan does, Bad Guy does better, except for maybe the verse in which Stan's talking in the tape recorder with his girlfriend in the trunk, and even that chilling moment of awesome can be rivalled by the final verse of Bad Guy.
Bad Guy has more detailed/complex storytelling, with a character that feels almost three dimensional as opposed to Stan Mitchell.
The 3rd verse with the voices of different personas is the most brilliant bit of acting/storytelling Em has done since Kim.
The story telling is more immersive etc etc.
The only reason I have for the first three verses being overlooked is that it prolly feels like a repeat of Stan.

[kkaniff]

Sorry for double post but...
"If i am to be completely, utterly
honest, Eminem just isnt that big of a
deal in 2013 anymore. People say
"yeah he is good, he has always been
good" and they lazily slap high ratings
on it."
Dude, did we read the same reviews?!
The album universally regarded Em's best and one of the greatest albums of all time has a Metacritic score of 78. 78!!
AbsolutePunk gave him a terrible loe review for no other reason other than his alleged homophobic slurs and that is a recurrent theme in most of the reviews.
Eminem has NEVER put out an album that has been universally acclaimed.

[kkaniff]

Sorry for double post but...
"If i am to be completely, utterly
honest, Eminem just isnt that big of a
deal in 2013 anymore. People say
"yeah he is good, he has always been
good" and they lazily slap high ratings
on it."
Dude, did we read the same reviews?!
The album universally regarded Em's best and one of the greatest albums of all time has a Metacritic score of 78. 78!!
AbsolutePunk gave him a terrible loe review for no other reason other than his alleged homophobic slurs and that is a recurrent theme in most of the reviews.
Eminem has NEVER put out an album that has been universally acclaimed.

[theJFKshow]

This thread is a fucking joke.

[nicknem]

In my opinion.

MMLP2 is certainly NOT a classic. It doesn't have the VIBE of an all-time classic. I don't know it just doesn't feel like it. We are huge stans and that's why we think this is amazing but to become a classic an album has to have an impact on the genre, on the society. Like MBDTF had. Like MMLP had. Like 2001 had.

Not MMLP2. Sorry but no, this is a good album, but Eminem doesn't surprise anymore. People are used to him and he doesn't really reinvent himself.

Concerning bad guy, I don't see why the hell you keep comparing it to Stan. Okay this is like a sequel but you don't have to compare it to the original song. Bad Guy is nothing compared to stan. It just feels good to old stans to hear Em say "I'm the bad guy who makes fun of people who die" with an imitation of his old voice. But still, nobody will remember this song except except us.

Stan is an all time classic because nobody had ever done that before. This was surprising. Everything was perfect. EVERYTHING. The flow, the beat, the hook, the lyrics, the WHOLE fucking story, this was huge and fresh, it was an instant hit. People used to listen to this shit everywhere and everybody knew the lyrics.

Bad Guy can't top Stan because the element of surprise is not there. Time has passed, it can't have the same impact. Nobody will ever say "Bad Guy was a game changer, everything changed in hip hop and music after this".

Stop dreaming people

That's life, that's all it is. Eminem isn't really relevant nowadays. He's still very good, probably the better lyricist and everything. But he isn't really in the competition. He was with Relapse, even with recovery, but I feel like this is it. People are now used to him.

Sure he will always be the the tony soprano of rap. But nobody will ever try to diss him and not because he is too good, but because this isn't useful.

[kkaniff]

@theJFKshow very insightful.
@nickem you're joking, right?
@SWA on point, as usual.

[Kill You]

In my opinion.

MMLP2 is certainly NOT a classic. It doesn't have the VIBE of an all-time classic. I don't know it just doesn't feel like it. We are huge stans and that's why we think this is amazing but to become a classic an album has to have an impact on the genre, on the society. Like MBDTF had. Like MMLP had. Like 2001 had.

Not MMLP2. Sorry but no, this is a good album, but Eminem doesn't surprise anymore. People are used to him and he doesn't really reinvent himself.

Concerning bad guy, I don't see why the hell you keep comparing it to Stan. Okay this is like a sequel but you don't have to compare it to the original song. Bad Guy is nothing compared to stan. It just feels good to old stans to hear Em say "I'm the bad guy who makes fun of people who die" with an imitation of his old voice. But still, nobody will remember this song except except us.

Stan is an all time classic because nobody had ever done that before. This was surprising. Everything was perfect. EVERYTHING. The flow, the beat, the hook, the lyrics, the WHOLE fucking story, this was huge and fresh, it was an instant hit. People used to listen to this shit everywhere and everybody knew the lyrics.

Bad Guy can't top Stan because the element of surprise is not there. Time has passed, it can't have the same impact. Nobody will ever say "Bad Guy was a game changer, everything changed in hip hop and music after this".

Stop dreaming people

That's life, that's all it is. Eminem isn't really relevant nowadays. He's still very good, probably the better lyricist and everything. But he isn't really in the competition. He was with Relapse, even with recovery, but I feel like this is it. People are now used to him.

Sure he will always be the the tony soprano of rap. But nobody will ever try to diss him and not because he is too good, but because this isn't useful.

MMLP2 shits on MBDTF, fuck that overrated album.

[yoda you can call me]

In my opinion.

MMLP2 is certainly NOT a classic. It doesn't have the VIBE of an all-time classic. I don't know it just doesn't feel like it. We are huge stans and that's why we think this is amazing but to become a classic an album has to have an impact on the genre, on the society. Like MBDTF had. Like MMLP had. Like 2001 had.

Not MMLP2. Sorry but no, this is a good album, but Eminem doesn't surprise anymore. People are used to him and he doesn't really reinvent himself.

Concerning bad guy, I don't see why the hell you keep comparing it to Stan. Okay this is like a sequel but you don't have to compare it to the original song. Bad Guy is nothing compared to stan. It just feels good to old stans to hear Em say "I'm the bad guy who makes fun of people who die" with an imitation of his old voice. But still, nobody will remember this song except except us.

Stan is an all time classic because nobody had ever done that before. This was surprising. Everything was perfect. EVERYTHING. The flow, the beat, the hook, the lyrics, the WHOLE fucking story, this was huge and fresh, it was an instant hit. People used to listen to this shit everywhere and everybody knew the lyrics.

Bad Guy can't top Stan because the element of surprise is not there. Time has passed, it can't have the same impact. Nobody will ever say "Bad Guy was a game changer, everything changed in hip hop and music after this".

Stop dreaming people

That's life, that's all it is. Eminem isn't really relevant nowadays. He's still very good, probably the better lyricist and everything. But he isn't really in the competition. He was with Relapse, even with recovery, but I feel like this is it. People are now used to him.

Sure he will always be the the tony soprano of rap. But nobody will ever try to diss him and not because he is too good, but because this isn't useful.

[nicknem]

Ahah. I was serious people. Not a troll.

I am not saying that MBDTF is better than MMLP2. Just that it feels fresher, and it will influence a lot more. When I first listened to it I was like "Wow, this is different". Sure if you pick each son one by one they are not as good as Eminem songs, but the album is really cohesive. There is a vibe.

[yoda you can call me]

Ahah. I was serious people. Not a troll.

I am not saying that MBDTF is better than MMLP2. Just that it feels fresher, and it will influence a lot more. When I first listened to it I was like "Wow, this is different". Sure if you pick each son one by one they are not as good as Eminem songs, but the album is really cohesive. There is a vibe.

when i listen to mmlp2 i get them classic vibes from it, not to fussed if the community don't accept it as a "hiphop classic", it's a classic to me, because it delivered my stan expectations and then some

[kkaniff]

@nickem what, in your opinion, did MBDTF influence?
As far as I know, it's just a really dope album.

[Rattle1]

eminem hasn't released a classic since 2002.

I really don't see mmlp2 becoming a classic when the album is not acclaimed at all, nobody is calling it a classic, absolutely nobody.

And very few people call mmlp2 a top 3 raoty